Who you going to vote for Prez?

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Kotoll, Aug 6, 2008.

  1. Kotoll Lord

  2. Pwning Lord

  3. Borric Der Kriegsminister

    Interesting, but still fantasy drivel. The GOP loves to cry 'flip-flop' like it's some sort of war cry, without realizing that they are just as guilty of changing their opinions on issues. Let's face it, most politicians will respond to the outcry of the masses and alter policies. That's what's good about the system. They shouldn't be punished for reconsidering issues and coming up with a plan that the people support.

    I am most certainly voting for Obama. Anyone who can look at McCain and think he has the ability to lead America out of the trouble we're in is fooling himself. I applaud McCain's service because as a combat veteran myself, I think it is difficult to be Commander in Chief without that sort of first hand experience. Although our last two presidents (Bush and Clinton) had no real military experience. Clinton managed to do ok, and while he was president we got our largest raises and budget increases since the middle of Regan's presidency. Bush on the other hand didn't support the troops adequately.

    I would vote for McCain over Bush anyday. I was hoping he got the nomination in 2000, because they we would have had two strong candidates in Gore and McCain, and regardless of who had won, the country would be in better shape than it is today. Unfortunately, that campaign against Bush destroyed McCain, and he's a meager shadow of his former self. The man no longer has the ability to lead. I'm fairly sure Obama should win in November, as McCain has alienated the base that gave Bush the White House (conservative christians). McCain's record says he is pro-choice and pro-gay rights, although his campaign is trying to make it seem he isn't. But the religious right knows this is a lie and won't vote for him. Without them, he doesn't have much of a chance.

    In the coming months, the GOP attack machine will roar into life, attempting to do what it has done for the past eight years: play on a combination of lies, hatemongering and fearmongering to try to swing the election their way. Only by being well-informed can America make the right choice. And Fox news doesn't count....

    Here's some food for thought on McCain:

  4. Pwning Lord

  5. I agree with borric, the article that pwning ghost posted is bull shit. I can make up shit about a candidate too, its not hard. I would be interested in that book you mentioned though. can you summarize it, pwning? maybe give a few of your favorite points from it?
  6. Borric Der Kriegsminister

    You could suggest it, but I'm not too concerned with what a disgraced crackpot pseudo-academic has to say. Corsi's writings are filled with inane conspiracy theories, racial hatemongering, homophobia, and plagiarism. His books and columns are nothing but poorly researched efforts into scaring white people in America. He's pretty much as completely full of shit as one person can be and still draw air. His conclusions are ludicrous and they don't pass any sort of academic criteria for research. But don't take my word on it, a quick Google search on him provides all the information you need to see that he's almost all wrong. As an academic and researcher, I'm appalled that this man has gotten such drivel published. He shames my profession.

    So yes, I'm very familiar with Dr Jerome Corsi. The fact that he can get such complete untruth published speaks of a huge problem in American society. Specifically that most people are ignorant and that it's far easier to hate than it is to understand. The GOP embraces ignorant racist America and fosters the idea that the white man is in danger of losing everything. It's rule through fear, and that's absolute horseshit.
  7. ouch...

    as much as I want to get obama into the white house, at this point in time im not sure if its gonig to happen. I mean, either one is better than Bush, but doesnt our country deserve more than "well, its not the worst president..."? Still...not sure if obama will get in because this country is still crippled by racism. Not just whities vs everyone else, but all ethnic backgrounds vs every other ethnic background. latin communities are finding it very hard to vote for a black president. If anyone acknowledges any middle eastern culture as valid they are automatically an evil terrorist. Religion still runs so many minds in this country and for those who arent smart enough to take the bible's lessons non-litereally, then anyone who is different is evil and can suck it apparently. (Note, I know nothing of religion)
  8. Agaris New Member

    Obama has zero military experience. I would have to agree with just about everything they have to say to vote for someone that hasn't served on some level. Military service drastically changed the way I look at the world and having a commander-in-chief that has never been a part of that culture doesn't sit well with me.

    McCain's military record is well known, but something he doesn't talk about much is that his son is an enlisted Marine deployed in Iraq and he has another son in the Naval Academy. This is someone who knows what it's like to be in war and what it's like to have your children be in war. This gives him tons of credibility and respect in my book.

    Looking past the military positions for a moment, there is a core element of Obama and the democrats in general that I don't agree with. They tend to believe that those Americans that are fortunate and doing well in life should be mandated to help others that are less fortunate. This is the core belief that all the specific issues like higher taxes on the rich, universal health care and welfare programs boil down to. I don't agree with this and that's a big reason why I don't vote for democrats. I think government should give people the freedom to succeed or fail on their own merits, and the freedom to choose what to do with their success, not redistribute their wealth.
  9. Salohcin Member

    Wow, no one can beat the reasoning.
  10. thorizdin Administrator

    Really? Is that truly what you want to see in the US? I have both served in the military and lived in public housing (aka the projects). I've been "less fortunate" but currently I'm in the top 3-4% income wise. I can remember a time when any married E-5 qualified for food stamps (which pissed me off as a young officer). The concept that progressive tax structures are somehow bad for most Americans isn't grounded in good economics, now that's not to say that progressive tax rates can't be taken too far since they can be.

    I'm not a Democrat or a Republican or even a Libertarian because my views don't line up well with any of the party platforms. (Pro gun rights, pro abortion, liberal on social issues, strong on individual rights, believing that much stronger regulations on lobbying are needed, seeing money in politics as the most critical problem we have, and seeing a role for government beyond what the Libertarians do makes me a perpetual outsider.)

    I haven't made a final decision on who I will vote for, but I do believe that no matter the outcome the next president will be much better than the current administration.
  11. Agaris New Member

    I'm not against fairly compensating military and government employees, although from my experience with the GS structure, the low end is paid far too much while the high end isn't paid nearly enough.

    I am against subsidizing people's poor decisions and ignorance. Take the recent housing bailout bill for example. I have a very modest home that I can afford and I make my payments on time. Why should I help pay to keep someone in a house they can't afford? Given this second chance, will they educate themselves on financial matters or will they continue to sign contracts without reading them and just hope for the best?

    What about universal health care? I stay away from processed food, I exercise and I don't smoke. Why should I pay for someone's treatment when they don't take care of themselves? I don't mind paying for catastrophic health problems that can ruin a person financially. That's the idea behind insurance...to take care of you when you get unlucky and have a bad accident or catch something rare. Heath insurance shouldn't be a savings fund to take care of anticipated health problems from living an unhealthy lifestyle, but I fear that's how more and more people see it these days.
  12. Cedwyn Banned

    I'm not American, and I am wondering why your president needs military experience to lead?
    And is presidency just a front for puppeting by international corporations to increase the sales in your capital-focused country?

    From my point of view, the more the United States private sectors gear for making money (and are supported by the government), the less liked you are globally.
  13. well, we could have a week long conversation about the reasons why we arent liked globally...

    but, I dont believe a prez needs military experience. Id say 80% of americans are sick and have been sick of sending out troops to every god damn corner of the world to pick fights or "bring peace" we arent naive, but there is just not much you can do to change a goverment like ours. if protest you're just labeled a hippy liberal with no economic or foreign policy knowledge

    If your government went out and bombed some place what could you do to stop them? say "hey I dont like that" well we do, and they keep going. our leaders at the current time are bat shit insane...
  14. Agaris New Member

    The president is at the top of the military chain of command. If the U.S. needs to decide whether or not to attack another country, the president makes the call. I personally prefer that someone with the power to give the military orders have some experience on the receiving end of orders.

    He certainly isn't a puppet, but the U.S. is based on capitalism and the president generally makes decisions that promote capitalistic beliefs.

    I'm not sure how much influence U.S. policy has on consumers in other countries. We can't make a law that forces France to build a McDonalds on every corner. When it comes to patent and copyright law, that IS pretty screwed up in the U.S. right now and doing the opposite of what it was intended to do.
  15. Hobohuman New Member

    Well for those of you that are voting for Obama.. it doesn't really matter because the majority of congress is republicans. No matter what he tries to do he will still have to play ball with Republicans, because if not he will be like a hampster in the cage running in circles. I do belive that a president needs to have a military background for a few reasons. It shows you the sacrafice that others do for the country, IE other politicians that dont let thier kids serve or even back when the draft was in place. Second, it gives you a sinse of pride and will to lead. Most Americans from any financial or social background doesn't have a clue how to lead or to set an example. I dont care to get into any other reasons atm. It didn't matter what president was elected this term because no one can correct the errors that were made in one term or can they pull us back out.

    I do beleive like the Democrats when they should put a higher tax on people that make more ei 250k+ a year. What happens when you raise the taxes on a family thats bairly getting by. They gets F*****, thats what. Altho this can breed worthless people that dont do anything and want to have everything taken care for them. Which also can breed hatetred between the "have nots" and those that "have"

    Another thing. i dont have a problem with black white azn mexican president. But if everyone wants equal right then stop saying your a minority. Your only a minority because you keep saying you are. Also things like BET, Black heritige week/month, MLK day, Mrs. Black amrican padgent should stop. I dont see any AET/WET/MET or any heritige months for anyone else.

    BTW I heard that Obama goes to an all Black church? is that true? like if i wanted to go there and become a member... id what get kicked out let in or what?

    Well thats my 2 cents... why is it called 2 cents when its only a pennie for your thoughts?? im getting robbed somewhere
  16. well, there was a scholarship group going around my college giving out $50 scholarships if you went on camera and told why you were proud of your Caucasian heritage. They were immediately shut down by the NAACP for being a racist and elitist organization...
  17. Salohcin Member

    That is a big one for me also, I am not racists, but lets face it. If there where "white" only schools/neighborhoods/churches they would freak.
  18. Kotoll Lord

  19. Tenet New Member

    Colbert for president.
  20. the government does not segregate ethnicities....not anymore.....
    ethnicities segregate themselves. even if you are not racist, you probably prefer being around those that are like yourself. for the longest time in America's history, minorities were forced into specific locations. when this happens for so long, it is very hard to get out of these communities. Its no wonder that there are things like black churches and schools. black people might make up 90% of the population of the area.

    The same goes for whitie, you might not be racist, but if you live in a wealthy white community, chances are you may have gone to a church that happens to be all white, a school that happens to be all white, but your not racist....right?

    ok, back on topic....I see where you guys are coming from with the prez needing military experience. as much as we like to think we are a modern, civilized society that does not need war, issues continue to come up in every generation that might require military strength. Look whats happening in russia right now. who would have thought that a mostly modern power like russia would pull this crap?

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